tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post1443707478656427657..comments2023-12-21T12:24:25.009-05:00Comments on Fight in the Dog: Bucknell's Methods and Lightweight RowingUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger98125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-33656856890145506112009-01-28T16:12:00.000-05:002009-01-28T16:12:00.000-05:00While this topic has largely come and gone (I am p...While this topic has largely come and gone (I am posting in 2009), I recently discovered this site and have been reading it for the past few hours. As a lightweight rower (men's) I understand the feeling that this category of the sport can leave people a bit jaded. While I won't comment on this instance of Bucknell in any way, shape or form, I will discuss a few things that have always weighed heavily on my mind as far as lightweight rowing is concerned.<BR/><BR/>I was grateful to my program (club) for allowing me to participate in rowing. I was not a model athlete (asthma) but put in the time and effort and turned out to be a competitive lw. However, there was no way I was ever going to be fielded in a heavyweight boat. What put the chip on my shoulder was the plucking of talent from the lightweight boat to improve the competitiveness of the heavyweight team. As a lightweight crew, having your best guys in the jv or even stroking the v8, you simply can't not sit after losing a close race or a championship and think that having those people in the boat with you could have made the difference. That is why many in the lw realm feel a bit like outcasts playing not second but third fiddle. If the point is to put out the most competitive lw boat, then why knife that boat in the back by taking out the strongest guys?<BR/><BR/>It is interesting that the subject currently debated is the exact opposite of that. There is absolutely no problem with taking people from the jv, v8, n8 or wherever, putting them in the lw8 and having them run a successful race. If you can succeed by doing things that way, then more power to ya. This is exactly what happens between the jv and top varsity boats all the time, people shuffle in and out depending on who has gotten better. As long as the weight restriction rules are adhered to by all teams, then there is nothing to complain about and the field is equal. This practice, however, does not help the sport and in my opinion hurts it.<BR/><BR/>After thinking about it, I would conclude that in order to grow the lw classification of the sport you would have to make a clean break with the heavyweights on the programmatic level. This is something hard for me to write (since my college program functioned as one big program), but having a separate lwt and hwt program ends the chances for people being plucked from either classification to water down or increase the competitiveness of either weight class. I feel like this would actually help the sport overall, greatly increasing the competitiveness of the lwt realm by putting back in those great people that could have made my boat a great crew, and not just a good crew.<BR/><BR/>Thats not to say that there won't be overlap between the weight classifications, since some lwts may want to give it a go and compete as a heavy, OR VICE VERSA, but in order to discourage the practice of stacking boats in either realm, and let people compete in their class, I would suggest that there can be no switching from one classification to another during spring racing season. Your roster must be set.<BR/><BR/>To strengthen the sport on the lwt level, we must put the best lwts together in a boat and have them compete the entire season. That is the same for the heavyweights. Unfortunately, if heavies and lwts are mixed and not in separate programs where one cannot take talent from the other pool, the temptation is too great. It seems like no one cares to talk much about the lwt arena being watered down because their men are put in heavyweight boats. One must be honest and realize that there is more focus and weight given to the heavyweight championship. Point blank. In order to change that, people inside of the sport must care enough to want to have a good lwt program. It takes old lwt oarsmen/women to advocate and push our ideals through.<BR/><BR/>If one pushes down heavies into a lwt boat, it is to win a race, and not build a program. I know this, because my own college program has done exactly that before (to win a cup at the sdcc). Whether your team is successful or not, all you've done is try and stack a boat for something temporary, and not create a culture that continues to produce a high quality lwt team for the future (again, these comments are not pointed toward Bucknell, but are my opinions about lwt management in general). You can't cultivate pride as a lwt rower if you don't practice with your comrades and race with the best boat possible. I don't know this first hand, but it would seem logical that the established lwt superpowers wouldn't have any problems with needing heavyweights to turn into their class, or to have their rowers taken out of their program. The focus here would be to get the best people into their respective boats! But again, it takes higher stakes (and more numerous and prominent lwt races, etc) to give an extra boost to the field. I am all about advocating for this kind of thing, and have wondered how to get involved in such pursuits. It just seems that up to now, the management of lightweight rowing has been lacking and simply does not provide the opportunities and competitiveness that it should be.<BR/><BR/>Lightweights forever.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-82608245204142610622008-03-30T14:37:00.000-04:002008-03-30T14:37:00.000-04:00Looks like you were the one to revive this, so I t...Looks like you were the one to revive this, so I think everyone has gotten over it. Trolling or poor effort to rile up your teammates?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-78842916810321742412008-03-25T16:17:00.000-04:002008-03-25T16:17:00.000-04:00Race #1 vs Temple LV8Race #2 vs Radcliffe 2LV8 and...Race #1 vs Temple LV8<BR/>Race #2 vs Radcliffe 2LV8 and URI 3V8<BR/>Race #3 in 2 4's vs. Susquehanna University LV4<BR/>Race #4- some weighed in right before Patriots and some right before ECACs<BR/><BR/>The IRA committee required 3 certified weighins (where the rower weighed in the day before a race at under 130, scale being checked by a person other than their coach).... if you can count, I believe that there are 4 races listed up there...<BR/><BR/>get your facts STRAIGHT... it has been almost a year since Bucknell won fair and square as LIGHTWEIGHTS, can't you just GET OVER IT!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-57726441875370795362008-03-24T21:56:00.000-04:002008-03-24T21:56:00.000-04:00All of the Bucknell Lightweights completed the sam...All of the Bucknell Lightweights completed the same Weigh-ins? Yeah right.Where? When? <BR/>Please!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-46984912392914531992008-02-28T09:03:00.000-05:002008-02-28T09:03:00.000-05:00Regarding... "Its completely unfair that their boa...Regarding... "Its completely unfair that their boat didn't have to weigh in the required amount of times before the IRA's. Ridiculous"...<BR/><BR/>Get your facts straight. All of the Bucknell lightweights completed the same amount of weigh-ins as everyone else at the IRA. Otherwise, they would not have been allowed to race. Best of luck with your training.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-63585815070015220812008-02-27T20:36:00.000-05:002008-02-27T20:36:00.000-05:00Come get us. We're ready.Come get us. We're ready.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-81029372994702645842007-08-19T17:35:00.000-04:002007-08-19T17:35:00.000-04:00OMG right ON w/ this post, you are so right about ...OMG right ON w/ this post, you are so right about Bucknell. Its completely unfair that their boat didn't have to weigh in the required amount of times before the IRA's. Ridiculous. But whatever side their playing this year our teams out to get them;)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-37402462160204987442007-08-14T22:22:00.000-04:002007-08-14T22:22:00.000-04:00http://rowinggirl.com/Home_Page.htmlThought this s...http://rowinggirl.com/Home_Page.html<BR/><BR/>Thought this site needed some publicity. At least it is kept up-to date by someone who caresAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-43437726360503214042007-08-12T00:41:00.000-04:002007-08-12T00:41:00.000-04:00"None of the women (open or light) who row in coll..."None of the women (open or light) who row in college do it for the glory or fame; for the popularity, money, or recognition......."<BR/><BR/>Oh come on, are you really this innocent? With very few exceptions, no athlete does their sport for these reasons. How famous are the lacrosse players at St Olaf's? How about the basketball players at SUNY-IT? Baseball at Dubuque? And what time do you think they are all practicing? That's right, many of them are in the gym at 5am as well. The lines you are repeating are one of the reasons rowing is often seen as a 2nd hand sport. Due to the fact that we self aggrandize ourselves with ridiculous statements like "rowing is the equivalent of 2 basketball games" and talk of our peers being in the bars at 4:30am. Our peers are the other athletes, they are in the gym, stop talking and simply act as an athlete.<BR/><BR/>I do not mean to single you out, but it has been far too often that I hear this line of self important thought that is not stated by any other athlete/sport. It makes us look like fools, particularly when half the rowing teams in this country are club level, full of students who are at practice at 4:30 but were at the pub at 4. They then spew forth the same line to justify their sport and are laughed at, taking the sport's reputation down with them. If you want respect, actions speak louder than words. Get yourself fit, carry yourself with confidence, and real athletes will begin to recognize how strong top rowers really are.<BR/><BR/>"We are one of the last sports left that is not corrupted and the athletes compete for pure reasons"<BR/><BR/>.....college scholarships??? Have you never seen the problems parents (and athletes) can cause on Juniors teams because of scholarships? I guarantee that if drugs aren't already making headway into the sport, they will soon. A chance at a free education is just too much for some people to turn away from (though it should be noted that money/fame is not always the prime motivation behind such cheating).<BR/><BR/>"Would the AD's from Princeton, Wisconsin, Radcliffe, MIT and Stanford all of a sudden say "scrap the lwt program! "<BR/><BR/>Once again, you are attempting to win one debate by creating another. Many of these programs have solid alumni connections who would fight or otherwise help support the teams. However other schools that do not have said alumni connections would just never create a team. The question isn't about maintaining the status quo, it is about expanding it. What impetus does Bucknell have to create a lightweight team now? For that matter, how about Alabama? And frankly, who's to say that another team won't follow Georgetown's path? Take a look at Rutgers on the men's side. Lots of alumni and multiple Olympians (I believe the most for the entire school). What has all this done for them? Nada.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-9171243670490371492007-08-10T16:53:00.000-04:002007-08-10T16:53:00.000-04:00Perfectly put. Rowing in general is marginalized ...Perfectly put. Rowing in general is marginalized within athletic departments in favor of more mainstream sports. None of the women (open or light) who row in college do it for the glory or fame; for the popularity, money, or recognition. The reason we all wake up at 4:30 am when our peers are stumbling back to thier rooms from the bars is that we all love the sport. Nobody of any age, gender or weight class would give the dedication that rowing requires without passion and love for the sport and thier teammates. It is the same sport, no matter what category you compete in, and the sport in general cannot afford to be petty and divided. We are one of the last sports left that is not corrupted and the athletes compete for pure reasons....lets not lose that for ourselves.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-29392104166399950802007-08-09T08:26:00.000-04:002007-08-09T08:26:00.000-04:00Rowers are rowers. If you are under 140lbs and wa...Rowers are rowers. If you are under 140lbs and want to classify yourself as a lwt, great. But you are still a rower, just not a "big" rower. Who cares. A rower is a rower. An athlete is an athlete. It seems comical to call an athlete a "lightweight athlete" when the 130lb mark is so arbitrary. They are ALL athletes.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-79492189575733027852007-08-08T18:06:00.000-04:002007-08-08T18:06:00.000-04:00Most of the time, I'd guess that when a new coach ...Most of the time, I'd guess that when a new coach drops the lw women's program, it is not because he/she wants to emulate Bucknell. It's because he/she has no experience with, or interest in, lw rowing, and may even, truth be told, disrespect lw rowers as athletes. Such sentiments are not unheard of. The loss of a program like Georgetown undercuts developing rivalries, further limits competitive opportunities, and hurts the sport.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-26071105104414988022007-08-08T08:54:00.000-04:002007-08-08T08:54:00.000-04:00Again what would happen if Georgetown showed up at...Again what would happen if Georgetown showed up at the IRA next year and won it, using the same "method" that Bucknell use? And then the next year Lehigh showed up and won it. What would happen? Would lightweight rowing disappear? Would the AD's from Princeton, Wisconsin, Radcliffe, MIT and Stanford all of a sudden say "scrap the lwt program! We obviously don't need it to go fast at the IRA!"?? I'm interested to hear an answer.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-69181111670254548542007-08-08T02:04:00.000-04:002007-08-08T02:04:00.000-04:00I am sick of the "club"argument. It is not about B...I am sick of the "club"argument. It is not about Bucknell being from outside the old girls network. It is about them not being a committed LT WT team. Last post said it perfectly.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-2823510016422892582007-08-07T23:23:00.000-04:002007-08-07T23:23:00.000-04:00"If she doesn't row in the lightweight events in t..."If she doesn't row in the lightweight events in the spring, should she not be allowed row in lightweight events in the suummer?"<BR/><BR/>Are you deliberately trying to create a strawman? There is no correlation between what you are saying and anything else said here. Look to below for why it hurts rowing.<BR/><BR/>"By your logic lightweight women's rowing should always be club."<BR/><BR/>How does anything here even remotely correlate with what you are saying? The reason Bucknell's actions hurt lightweight rowing is because it gives AD's more incentive to not field regular lightweight teams. They see that you can just throw together your lighties at the end of the year and bam, national champions. The alternative that would be better, better as in providing more opportunities for lightweights, would be pressing the issue of dedicated lightweight teams. As for the club comment, people are saying the exact opposite. The logic is that lightweights ought to fight to be raised to varsity status, either as their own program or as dedicated lightweight boats within the openweight program. If you have a dedicated program, then you have 32+ seats (V, 2V, N, etc...). If you have a dedicated boat then you have all the women who make it to the openweight V, plus an additional 8-10 for the lightweight boat. If you only have a lightweight boat at the end of the year for kicks, then there is no incentive to ever have more than 8 lightweights, which you may not carry every year. Do the math, which option creates more opportunity for lightweights?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-62369042298649300192007-08-07T11:57:00.000-04:002007-08-07T11:57:00.000-04:00Bucknell didn't hurt LW rowing by not rowing much ...Bucknell didn't hurt LW rowing by not rowing much as LW's during the year. They did make it more exciting because no one knew how fast they were going to be. <BR/><BR/>By your logic lightweight women's rowing should always be club. Let's just be happy lightweight rowers are able to be on the team without paying dues. This will spur angry posts, but let's be honest, title IX's goal was not allow us to be raised to Varsity and men's clubs stay at club.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-48989280251616586182007-08-07T00:05:00.000-04:002007-08-07T00:05:00.000-04:00Should a lightweight woman be not allowed to row i...Should a lightweight woman be not allowed to row in the varsity eight and then also rowing in the lightweight eight at the end of the season? If she doesn't row in the lightweight events in the spring, should she not be allowed row in lightweight events in the suummer?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-11951190725495652472007-08-06T22:18:00.000-04:002007-08-06T22:18:00.000-04:00Yep. Georgetown coach obviously can't think for h...Yep. Georgetown coach obviously can't think for himself. Bucknell coach is that influential. <BR/><BR/>What would happen if Georgetown showed up at the IRA next year and won it, using the same "method" that Bucknell used. And then the next year Lehigh showed up and won it. What would happen? Would lightweight rowing disappear? Did Bucknell get rid of lightweight rowing? If Georgetown gets rid of lightweight rowing and doesn't row at the IRA, are we blaming Bucknell?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-50247739873280048232007-08-06T20:45:00.000-04:002007-08-06T20:45:00.000-04:00Dear lord where have you been- they hurt ltwt rowi...Dear lord where have you been- they hurt ltwt rowing because they dont race as ltwts during the season at all until IRAs. Honestly, have you been paying attention? Ofcousre, they won fair and square , but they have hurt the sport - that seems clear. And now Georgetown is either getting rid of Lt wt or following in Bucknell's footsteps.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-12417218057081439982007-08-06T20:38:00.000-04:002007-08-06T20:38:00.000-04:00Bucknell put its lightweights and heavyweights tog...Bucknell put its lightweights and heavyweights together and won IRA. Seemed to work for them...so it's hard to fault their methods if they get results. <BR/><BR/>I don't think it's fair to say that because they were successful after using a non-traditional method that they are ruining lwt rowing.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-13596566678080969212007-08-06T17:15:00.000-04:002007-08-06T17:15:00.000-04:00O'Connor should be using his new position as PanAm...O'Connor should be using his new position as PanAm coach to circulate his resume... <BR/>How is Bucknell moving in the right direction? Georgetown is modeling its furiture using Bucknell as its model and LtWt rowing will suffer as a result.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-55800581893795581332007-08-04T23:26:00.000-04:002007-08-04T23:26:00.000-04:00Bummer about georgetownHowever Dayton just went th...Bummer about georgetown<BR/><BR/>However Dayton just went through a coaching change and things seem to be really looking up for their lightweight program. Dayton a team to watch?<BR/><BR/>for more check out their homepage<BR/>http://daytonflyers.cstv.com/sports/w-rowing/dayt-w-rowing-body.htmlAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-58459155935313559842007-08-02T09:40:00.000-04:002007-08-02T09:40:00.000-04:00JW, Where are you? Come back! Please!JW, Where are you? Come back! Please!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-85145169856994868362007-07-31T01:29:00.000-04:002007-07-31T01:29:00.000-04:00Transfer.Transfer.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14345420.post-31540611019374618872007-07-30T19:00:00.000-04:002007-07-30T19:00:00.000-04:00Bucknell is at a crossroads and going in the right...Bucknell is at a crossroads and going in the right direction, whereas GT is heading away from everything they've worked for. This affects the Hoyas today, but it isn't good for future lightweights anywhere. This new coach "sold" his philosophy to the athletic department. The department is not responding to any of the girls' letters. Anyone have any ideas?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com